5.2.06

Hello and welcome to the 21st century

You feel insulted? Go live in the friggin' desert.


Hello! Welcome to the 21st century. Things have changed a lot in the past millenium. Nowadays, there are moving pictures that let you "watch" real things happening in real places all over the world (it's round, by the way). You can write a letter and send it across that self-same world in a split second. You like porn? it's all there....

Here's a trick you may not know. Your eyes... they close. Your mind... it makes decisions. You no likey porn? you no go to www.sex.com.

Pretty simple, innit?

So, what's the big deal? A few caricatures... right... let's blow up the world, that's an appropriate reaction.

Let me tell you a story... A Danish author was writing a book about the Prophet and founder of Islam, Mohammed. He complained that no one would illustrate his book. A big Danish newspaper challenged anyone to make those illustrations and promised to publish them. That happened on September 30th.

One young Imam felt insulted. Instead of doing what normal people would do, SUE those involved, he tried to ignite the masses. The Danish muslims weren't completely infuriated as (they seem to have mastered those two aforementioned tricks)... so the Imam took the caricatures, added a few that were not part of the story, but that would definitely incite anger (the prophet as a pig, the prophet as a dog); very blunt caricatures that would easily light the cummulative fuse of the muslim world... and toured the muslim capitals, showing these photos and building up anger....

wham... bam... burn the embassies! Acting like terrorists ought to show the world that you're not.... That makes sense.

Down with Europe. Ignorant fools. Death to this and that... What a prosperous industry. We produce banners, t-shirts, molotov cocktails... Give us a name, any name, and you can have your "death to ..." within the hour. Burn yourself, it's all for a good cause. Blow yourself up, that'll send a message.

Welcome to the 21st century. We discuss our problems, we try to meet on middle ground, we try to resolve conflict by dealing with its root. You see the everyone and everything as your enemy, you see violence as the only way, you blow yourselves up.

Welcome to the 21st century. The struggle of our day is not one between the east and the west. It's a struggle between ignorance and knowledge. You've chosen your side.

106 Comments:

At Sunday, February 05, 2006 3:08:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

Dr. As'ad Abu Khalil sums it up pretty neatly:

"Would those same publications dare to reprint the grotesque anti-Semitism of, say the Nazi "historian" David Irving (who sits in an Austrian jail for violating the law there which bans anti-Semitic speech, and we don't see people defending his right of freedom of speech--I would not either), in the name of “free speech”? This is something that is at the heart of the controversy. The double and triple standards of Western governments are quite clear, even if you take “freedom of expression” as a criterion of analysis. Al-Manar TV, for example, has been banned from Europe and the US for anti-Jewish messages and statements contained in a few of its programs. European media did not defend Al-Manar, and did not rebroadcast the programs in question in the name of solidarity."

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 3:18:00 PM, Blogger Jamal said...

I think a Gag order on all inflamatory remarks would be useful right about now.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 3:32:00 PM, Blogger Ramz said...

As'ad is a washed out hippie who bites the hand that is feeding him.

Furthermore, this wasn't hate literature, it was caricatures... there's a HUGE difference.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 3:36:00 PM, Blogger JoseyWales said...

The violence in Beirut, at the Danish Consulate, was predictable and preventable.

The Interior Minister has to resign. He is useless. On Hariri, Tueni, Jibreel etc.. we know the excuses and it's complicated. What is the excuse here?

Marsden, wake me up when the JOOZ behead a guy on video, or when they burn their next embassy.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 3:36:00 PM, Blogger desmond said...

Well said, Ramz. We are rapidly returning to the Dark Ages.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 4:11:00 PM, Blogger zwixo said...

marsden,

this controversy you talk about is debatable, but the thing is, behind the Nazis, there isn't only thought, there's a war that left europe in ashes, death and hatred, racism and murder. Behind a cartoonist is ONLY thought, satire, critisism, dark humor, maybe hurtful to the feelings. Hell my ex-girlfriend hurt my feelings, I gonna go burn her embassy right NOW! Declare war against all her family, those imperialistic zionist bastards.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 4:46:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

this wasn't hate literature, it was caricatures...
Please see the latest post in my blog, then! :-)

So As'ad is a hippie and that ought to discredit his opinion? Classic case of fallacy, as any Philosophy 101 student would tell you.

Behind a cartoonist is ONLY thought
Thoughts lead to feelings and feelings often lead to actions. Remember that anti-Semitism in Europe started in such "innocent" ways.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 5:02:00 PM, Blogger nobilis tobilis said...

Ramz
U're right. If you feel insulted, go back to ur country (like the issue of the veil in France).
Anb abot, East and West, as u said, why is this always a criteria for comparing. The problem is not East and West. It's more than that. It's Knowledge-Ignorance, Open-Minded/Narrow-minded, civilized/uncivilized, freedom/oppression.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 5:10:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

nobilis tobilis, so insult has to do with where one lives, in this age of mass communication?

You are yet to explain the West's obsession with (i.e. against) anything that depicts Jews in a negative light (even caricatures!) and their insensitivity towards Muslims' feelings. This has nothing to do with freedom of speech / secularism / atheism and more to do with racism and the "threat" they feel from the growing Muslim population in Europe (see for example the reasons for refusing to accept Turkey into the EU).

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 5:14:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

Btw, I have never heard anyone tell the Jews "go to your country if you don't like our caricatures depicting you with long, crooked noses". Maybe it's because they never get published anyway, and if they do the West would be crying out loud over it. Again, double standards.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 5:27:00 PM, Blogger zwixo said...

i'm sick with ur double standards "end racism". Israel is evil, don't you think we know it. What do you want. Do you want the danes to draws Moses as a monkey; i'll do it for you, happy now! if the Israelis start burning embassies, then you think we'll be happy about it. What do you want: you want the west to bunr Israel. I wish that israel can vanish in thin air, but it won't happen. You think you're gonna tell the danes what to do, dream on buddy.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 5:31:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

Man, where did I even mention Israel??? What is your problem? I'm talking about Jews, and know that Jews are not the same thing as Israel.

It's not up to me to tell the Danes what to do; but I certainly have the right to burn the embassy of any racist country that offends me in my own country; they can't use the "we can do whatever we want in our country, so if you don't like it, leave" and then whine when we do the same. So they should leave if they don't like what we're doing. As simple as that. W raw7a bala raj3a! By the way, there are many Muslim Danes, so if *I* can't tell them what to do, THEY can, because they are citizens of a country and their country has offended them.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 5:46:00 PM, Blogger nobilis tobilis said...

No, "end racism" it's not only insult. For example, for the muslim community in Europe, they should abide by the rules in Europe. If they don't, or if they are annoyed by the democracy there, they don't have to live there. They are free to return to their homeland. Anyway, it's not the topic. Btw, join the sit-in at 7 pm in front of St. Maroun church in Gemmayze, Against violence, sectrianism and racism.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 5:47:00 PM, Blogger JoseyWales said...

As usual, some want to revisit Palestine, Israel, and the Jews and blah blah.

This is about law breakers let loose, and the citizen left unprotected thanks to a weak gvmnt . and apologists (right here) who defend these criminals.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 5:59:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

for the muslim community in Europe, they should abide by the rules in Europe
They have the same rights as the "Europeans". Period. Rights are based on citizenship in the West, according to Western critics of the Arab world, no? Want to have double standards EVEN in that??

They are free to return to their homeland.
Islam is not a religion based on ethnicity. So what would happen to the Muslims who are say Danish by origin (and not just citizenship) if they don't like the racism of their fellow countrymen which is supported by their government? Where would they go?

I will not join any sit-in with people who call me a barbarian.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 6:35:00 PM, Blogger arch.memory said...

Ramz, this is brilliant! I LOVE the sarcasm, the bitterness (and I am not being sarcastic here)... Well said! I fear, however, that it is wasted on those who need it most.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 7:00:00 PM, Blogger Vox Populi - Agent Provocateur said...

"Would those same publications dare to reprint the grotesque anti-Semitism of, say the Nazi "historian" David Irving (who sits in an Austrian jail for violating the law there which bans anti-Semitic speech, and we don't see people defending his right of freedom of speech--I would not either), in the name of “free speech”? "

Yes they would reproduce it, but there's no point in doing it because it is Muslims and not Jewish who are threatening freedom of speech.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 7:02:00 PM, Blogger Vox Populi - Agent Provocateur said...

"
I will not join any sit-in with people who call me a barbarian"

Who said that people like you are welcome anyway?

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 7:03:00 PM, Blogger JoseyWales said...

Where would they go?

Who cares? Wherever they want, or don't go and stay. They just have to deal with life in their own way and BEAR the consequences.

You have a problem, deal with it without burning embassies. Just like a law-abiding atheist in Saudi, or a communist in a capitalist country or vice-versa.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 7:10:00 PM, Blogger JoseyWales said...

Add:

Successful societies and cultures work to benefit a large majority, while minimizing harm and inconvenience to minorities.

No culture can possibly satisfy the whim of every individual in its midst, from the vegetarian to the left hander to the guy who does not like the color pink.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 7:34:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

Yes they would reproduce it, but there's no point in doing it because it is Muslims and not Jewish who are threatening freedom of speech.
Right, because it's the Muslims who go about trying to silence anyone DOUBTING the holocaust... :)

Who said that people like you are welcome anyway?
If I had wanted to go I would not await your "OK". I am free to do as I wish in my country.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 8:55:00 PM, Blogger Lazarus said...

end racism ...

i have to say i am confused. some of your points may be valid, but do you think the current and extremely excessive reactions are valid? we can discuss the hypocricies of freedom of speech, but more importantly, we have to discuss the reactions to violations of such freedoms (if this cartoons were in fact violations), and whether the current violence is justified.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 9:03:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

The attack on the Church is in NO WAY justified, and I absolutely condemn it, as I condemn the attack on the property of regular people. But the torching of the embassy itself is an act I am willing to "turn a blind eye to" because I find it justified, having in mind the bad faith of printing the cartoons and the unsatisfactory reaction of the authorities to them (JUST an apology???) I say, if they will not respect us, they are not welcome in our country.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 9:57:00 PM, Blogger callipyge said...

I used to think they had a right to be offended by the cartoons, and still do, BUT torching embassies is showing the west that those caricatures were perhaps not just stereotypes.
For ONCE muslims had some form of upper hand in demanding respect for themselves and their culture, but, of course, they had to SPOIL EVERYTHING by resorting to unacceptable violence against foreign property. Scandinavians are now urged to leave Lebanon and will probably be advised not to travel here for a while. GREAT, that's exactly what Lebanon needed right now! Why is the government not arresting anyone?
I don't know how they felt while young unemployed French immigrants were torching cars and school buildings to protest against their miserable conditions. I used to find them barbaric and worthy of punishment. It is sad to see that international muslims have regressed to that level as well. I will not be ashamed of being a muslim or of disliking those cartoons, but I am definitely ashamed of being associated with lowlives and creeps like those pyromaniacs who turn the act of being angry at the cartoons into acts of terrorism.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 10:09:00 PM, Blogger JoseyWales said...

Shocked but glad to see that Sabeh, the interior minister, resigned according to reports (Lebanonwire).

I hope no one talks him out of it.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 10:29:00 PM, Blogger nobilis tobilis said...

end racism
I think i have nothing to say to u. It's clear that your way of viewing things and your approaches are different. You find that destroying embassies is an appropriate and civilized way in dealing with the problem of caricatures. As Callypige said, "they spoiled evrything". And btw, I'm asking myself, why did the embassies destruction happen only in Syria and Lebanon? And why were they plenty of syrians and palestinians among the protestants?

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 10:30:00 PM, Blogger Maldoror said...

I think you got it all wrong peeps! You are discussing a never-ending topic and you are just missing the whole picture!
News: At least 70 Syrians were there!

Ring any bells?!?!?!??!?!

Syrians in a Christian neighborhood, destroying and stealing...

Ring any bells!?

They were helped by some 35 Lebanese *shitheads*!

Ring any bells?!

Wake up and stop discussing problems about Jews and Muslims.

Dear Muslims and Christians of Lebanon. Those who care about their country, WE have an ENEMY!

What are u going to do about it?!

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 10:33:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

torching embassies is showing the west that those caricatures were perhaps not just stereotypes.
That is irrelevant. It still incites hatred. If they are right about Muslims' "character" why do they need to depict it in cartoons, just let the Muslims show their "true colours". Do not minimize the significance of their agenda.

Nobilis tobilis, never said "civilized". Uncivilized people who have no respect for people's sensitivities, religious beliefs, etc. do not deserve a "civilized" response. Every action has an equal and opposite reaction.

The West WILL go down. Mark my words.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 10:35:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

Oh no, now we're back to blaming the Syrians for it when the Hariri Inc. did nothing to stop the behaviour as they did with the Welsh protest. Says something about their priorities.

NO to selling Lebanon to USA and the West!!!!!!!!!

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 10:42:00 PM, Blogger Ramz said...

Very interesting commentary, for the most part. Arch, you're absolutely right, sadly...

Marsden, I'd love to know who taught you physics... "an equal and opposite reaction"!!!!!!

You're as absurd as your arguments and the arguments of the people you're supporting. The caricatures that upset them the most were fabricated by the imam. Even if they weren't, it doesn't justify violence... by no means!

Weren't you protesting the attacks on Syrian workers in Lebanon during the protests... those were unjustified and barbaric... since they went against your "political view", torching embassies because of a friggin' cartoon is justified.

Dude, you make me want to iterate between laughing, crying and throwing up.

sheesh.

"the west will go down"... well, the east has nothing to complain about, right? going down is what it's all about.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 11:00:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

Weren't you protesting the attacks on Syrian workers in Lebanon during the protests... those were unjustified and barbaric... since they went against your "political view", torching embassies because of a friggin' cartoon is justified.
Protesting attacks on PEOPLE is the same as protesting attacks on PROPERTY that houses the mission/embassy of a RACIST COUNTRY AND GOVERNMENT THAT MERELY ISSUED AN APOLOGY AND TOOK NO MEASURES TO PERSECUTE THOSE WHO PUBLISHED IT LIKE IT IS DONE IN EUROPE TO HOLOCAUST DOUBTERS AND DENIERS? Thanks for letting me know what your priorities are.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 11:08:00 PM, Blogger Ramz said...

1 newspaper x (10 caricatures) = racist country.

I'd love to know who taught you math as well... :)

Your problem: bla bla bla, yada yada holocaust... woo hoo boo zionism... wewe tete zeze isreal.

Critical thinking... who was your teacher?

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 11:11:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

Don't get me started on critical thinking, because then I would write a thesis on your post above. ;) Let's just say that you are trying to change the topic and are committing a number of fallacies. Now for homework, I want you to go and find what fallacies you have committed.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 11:16:00 PM, Blogger Ramz said...

dude... I just got my M.Sc. four days ago.... I'm not doing any homework. We can discuss it over a good bottle of single malt, if you wish.

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 11:29:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

Congrats on that. And no thanks, I don't drink. Anyway, back to the topic...

 
At Sunday, February 05, 2006 11:47:00 PM, Blogger Ramz said...

the topic is not being dealt with... it's useless, you're not willing to even listen to anything anyone is saying, so what's the point!?

What do you have to say regarding the fact that that Imam added three caricatures (the most insulting three) to the set he showed to everyone? Is that of any importance?

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 12:01:00 AM, Blogger End racism said...

Yes of course I am listening, but you are refusing to see why we're angry (maybe people overreacted and I already said it was wrong to attack the church and private property) but the publishing of the cartoons had a sinister agenda behind it. And that alone is enough to cause outrage, not to mention the way the Danes dealt with it.

With regards to the "three caricatures", I am yet to see them. And I am not interested in seeing them either, the 12 were in bad faith enough. Would you please name the Imam who showed the additional 3?

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 12:52:00 AM, Blogger Ramz said...

no problem. Ahmed Abdel Rahman Abu Laban is the guy.

These are the original drawings

These are the three drawings that that liar added to incite the ignorant masses.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 1:12:00 AM, Blogger End racism said...

Oh nooooo, it's not obvious which one is done by the Danes and which one isn't... *rolls eyes* Seriously, you insult my and others' intelligence.

By the way, those other drawings were actually presented in Egypt by the Imam, they were part of the campaign to spread awareness of Islamophobia that was widespread in Denmark and Europe. Just a FYI.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 1:20:00 AM, Blogger Ramz said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 1:24:00 AM, Blogger Ramz said...

what are you trying to say? I told you they weren't published by JP, I told you the Imam added them to the others on his "rock the islamic world" 2006 tour...

Your intelligence?! You asked for the photos, I showed them to ya. simple as that. I'd give you the newspaper link, but traffic has killed it for now.

Photos that say mohammed is a pig are necessary to spread awareness?!?! Suddenly the guy was on an awareness campaign? Spreading awareness of Islamophobia?! The man couldn't get the muslims in Denmark riled up, so he tried to get other, more impressionable muslims angry and protesting.

Dude, you should try to make some more sense... anyway, i'm done here.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 1:36:00 AM, Blogger End racism said...

My point was, the photos were not drawn by the Imam.... That's what the point was. Get it?

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 6:10:00 AM, Blogger Vox Populi - Agent Provocateur said...

If anybody is interested to see what the friends of the guy racist guy above did, click below

http://www.cnn.com/video/player/player.html?url=/video/world/2006/02/05/sadler.cartoon.beirut.ap

A horde of animals, that's what they are.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 8:34:00 AM, Blogger Bo Derek said...

Ahem. The bomb-head one is the one that everybody says is insulting them. The one drawn by the Danish cartoonist. Not the one by "Ahmed".

Ramz, you are a troll.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 10:07:00 AM, Blogger Eve said...

Vox & Bo derek,
if you want to be a part of this discussion, plz refrain from terms like "racist" & "troll" towards other bloggers. Keep it civilized.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 12:36:00 PM, Blogger Delirious said...

Ramz ~ Absolutely brilliant.

Maldoror ~ Open your eyes wide and look beyond the obvious, eh?

End racism ~ "I certainly have the right to burn the embassy of any racist country that offends me in my own country". Really? Who gave you that right? What racist country? And how did it offend you in your own country?

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 1:08:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

Who gave you that right?
I do not need to be "given" the right to burn the embassy of a racist country that considers me and my brothers and sisters a demographic threat and talks of "integration" in a letter that had to be about apologizing for the publishing of offensive cartoons and firing the editor. A country that has not taken steps to persecute these people for inciting hatred but will most probably talk about (like in the UK they are thinking of doing) charging the protestors with incitement. Surely I do not need permission from anyone to torch the embassy of such a country in my OWN country.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 1:15:00 PM, Blogger Ramz said...

B.D. do you even know what a troll is?

Marsden, all this anger just because of a weird sense of guilt you have, so strange. Kid, you have NO right... just like those pigs had no right to go on a rampage in Beirut.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 1:31:00 PM, Blogger nobilis tobilis said...

end racism
my advice for you is to think rationally for once. Stop having those fake reactions. And by the way, who told u that u have the right to burn embassies as long as they are in your OWN country?

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 2:13:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

Ramz, sense of guilt??? Why would I feel guilty, and about what???

Nobilis tobilis, I have the right to do what I want. Consequences are a totally different matter.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 3:46:00 PM, Blogger gabrielf said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 3:54:00 PM, Blogger gabrielf said...

yeah right so i think i just might go and blow of the iranian embassy just because i dont like their politics ...
"end racism" just end your barbarian thinking.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 4:42:00 PM, Blogger Bo Derek said...

Do I know what a troll is. Well I guess everyone's definition is different. For starters, I would say whoever made up the pig picture was trolling. Some people call it psychological warfare.

And when the person in question doesn't think caricatures or porn are any big deal, he's hardly going to be offended by being called a troll. It never offends me anyway. But there you have it, each to his own. One man is offended by a caricature, another is offended by a nick-name.

I'll be on my way now.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 4:53:00 PM, Blogger zwixo said...

at the end of the day, we ALL, and I mean ALL, even you "end racism" wish your country was as great as Denmark. A country where you can have a life not be part of a farm. You think it's a coincidence that all the country we are caught so many times whine about: "If only we followed the law like that here, if only we had such politicians", are the ones in which freedom of speech somes first. Except if you dream of living in Iran: "Oh how i wish I can move to Iran and enjoy that wonderful... Prison!"

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 5:02:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

Zwixo, if I wished Lebanon were "as great as" Denmark I would've moved to Denmark, as simple as that.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 6:09:00 PM, Blogger zwixo said...

no you wouldn't, it's not like 123 u know, because the ones you love are here, this is your country, but your government's system sucks; then you say: I wish this country was as great as Norway.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 6:17:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

You are assuming too much.

1. I don't have anyone here.
2. I don't see what is so "great" about Norway or Denmark.
3. All governments suck. They should all be dismantled.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 7:13:00 PM, Blogger gabrielf said...

end racism>>well we see where u r comin from, r u friends with bashar el-assad or some other dictator???

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 10:24:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

Is that the best you can come up with, Gabriel? Those who disagree with you are necessarily supporters or friends of Bashar el Assad?

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 10:32:00 PM, Blogger Vox Populi - Agent Provocateur said...

Eve, I never restrain myself. If you want to censor me go ahead, but I won't change anything in what I am saying.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 10:36:00 PM, Blogger Vox Populi - Agent Provocateur said...

"I do not need to be "given" the right to burn the embassy of a racist country that considers me and my brothers and sisters a demographic threat and talks of "integration" in a letter that had to be about apologizing for the publishing of offensive cartoons and firing the editor. A country that has not taken steps to persecute these people for inciting hatred but will most probably talk about (like in the UK they are thinking of doing) charging the protestors with incitement. Surely I do not need permission from anyone to torch the embassy of such a country in my OWN country."

It's not your OWN country, it's OUR country and it's certainly not your neighbourhood.

This guy claims that he is not racist, yet he generalize about all the Danes because ONE Danish newspaper published cartoons that he feels are offensive.

50% hypocrit, 50% moron. 100% fanatic.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 10:48:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

I am not generalizing about the Danes. I am saying the Danish government (the embassy is its representative) is not welcome.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 11:09:00 PM, Blogger Maldoror said...

Please! Once again we remind u to keep ur posts and comments civilised. Otherwise we will be forced to delete them, because after all this is a public blog! :)

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 11:26:00 PM, Blogger desmond said...

They don't have the "right" to burn an embassy as any sovereign state's embassy is considered as part of their nation. The Danish consulate is in fact Danish territory. Invading someone's territory is an act of war.

end racism, "I say, if they will not respect us, they are not welcome in our country."
What hypocrisy.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 11:28:00 PM, Blogger Vox Populi - Agent Provocateur said...

"I am not generalizing about the Danes. I am saying the Danish government (the embassy is its representative) is not welcome."


What did the Danish government do to you?

And who appointed you as the representative of the Lebanese people? Are you the foreign minster? Please tell us.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 11:29:00 PM, Blogger Vox Populi - Agent Provocateur said...

"Please! Once again we remind u to keep ur posts and comments civilised. Otherwise we will be forced to delete them, because after all this is a public blog! :) "

Unless you think like the mob, freedom of expression is total.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 11:33:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

The Danish consulate is in fact Danish territory.
Actually, it is not, as the entire plot does not belong to the Danish government.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 11:34:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

And who appointed you as the representative of the Lebanese people? Are you the foreign minster? Please tell us.
I never claimed to represent anyone but myself. And let me remind you that one person can set fire to an embassy (even if he/she has to face the consequences).

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 11:40:00 PM, Blogger desmond said...

end racism,
any consulate or embassy is the national territory of that country, even if it is a broom cupboard in a skyscraper belonging to someone else. Your arguments are starting to stretch anybody's intellectual patience.

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 11:47:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

Desmond, at the end of the day, when that match hits the gasoline, it does not matter whose sovereign territory it is. Get the point? :)

 
At Monday, February 06, 2006 11:51:00 PM, Blogger desmond said...

end racism,
No, I truly don't get the point. You complain about everyone else being intolerant, yet you are the worst offender on this board.

 
At Tuesday, February 07, 2006 12:15:00 AM, Blogger End racism said...

I only complained about racial intolerance, which is in no way justified. Not once did I complain about intolerance of states/governments. Intolerance will certainly be met with intolerance. Don't expect us to "turn the other cheek", eh?

 
At Tuesday, February 07, 2006 1:12:00 AM, Blogger Lazarus said...

End Racism:

Intolerance will certainly be met with intolerance.

Who will end the cycle then?

Vox:

freedom of expression is total. .

There are ways to express yourself, and there are ways to express yourself. Choose the more sensible one.

with regards to the entire conversation above: Wow.

 
At Tuesday, February 07, 2006 1:13:00 AM, Blogger Ramz said...

Marsden, did you convert to Islam just in order to be offended by these cartoons?

Or are you just pretending to be a muslim because you feel it provides support for you in your opposition to everything western?

Your arguments are empty, and you're suddenly resorting to silliness as an argument... Do you really expect anyone to take you seriously?

Anarchists are SO 1995... come on...

One justification is all I want. One justification as to why it's a valid reaction to an offensive cartoon to burn the building housing the danish consulate (possibly killing anyone in there), and destroying property all around the building, not to mention a church (with people praying in it)...

Also, how could you justify something like that, when you completely opposed beating up innocent Syrian workers because of what their government did to us?

Two equally irrational activities... yet you oppose one and approve of the other... it can only lead me to believe that you have your own silly preconcieved notions, and are not unwilling to twist everything around in order to suit your warped world vision.

It's sad.

 
At Tuesday, February 07, 2006 1:31:00 AM, Blogger End racism said...

Ramz, I have not yet converted to Islam. And when I do, it will not be to oppose the West (I don't need religion to do that).

The reaction is valid because there is an agenda behind the cartoon. And please, it was obvious that the building had been abandoned, the Danes had left 2 days before it happened.

 
At Tuesday, February 07, 2006 1:36:00 AM, Blogger Ramz said...

the danes were on the fourth floor... what about the other three? was the street empty a well? was the church empty?

what fucking agenda? You know as well as I do the entire story behind that. It was offensive, yes, but it was a piece of work submitted by various caricaturists from all over the country in response to a request the newspaper issued... they may have been offensive (not as much as the ones that crazy imam took with him, but whatever...)

I'll tell you about an agenda. The people behind the violence, they have an agenda. They want to turn and twist everything into a personal insult, and use it to ignite the muslim world.

 
At Tuesday, February 07, 2006 1:42:00 AM, Blogger End racism said...

I already said it was wrong to target other private property and the Church.........

As for the agenda, I will leave it to you to discover. Surely you have seen this:

http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/7232/936/1600/legacy_468.gif

 
At Tuesday, February 07, 2006 2:06:00 AM, Blogger Maldoror said...

Tempest,
are u still living in that WESTERN country called Germany?
I advise u to go destroy that danish embassy there! I won't tell anyone :P

 
At Tuesday, February 07, 2006 2:08:00 AM, Blogger Ramz said...

what's WRONG with that?

apart from the small "burka" thing. Is it not a fact that the burka has become a symbol of opression?

You see one side of the story... what about all the anti-christian, anti-jewish, anti-everything-not-on-your-side crap that "your people" do? What about the people they murder, the people the opress? Or is that all a "reaction"?

 
At Tuesday, February 07, 2006 2:12:00 AM, Blogger Ramz said...

maldy, you're trying to censor me... I'm going to burn blogger.

 
At Tuesday, February 07, 2006 2:20:00 AM, Blogger shlon said...

totally agree with the first post. Then again, totally agree with lots of things... And not with others :) mmmh weird huh //

With no sense of chronological order //

Syrians and palestinians have been arrested by a police that had all interest to arrest a lot of syrians as well as a lot of palestinians. otherwise, this day would have turned... sour :)
[false equation // but intelligent approach] war will wait a little...

As for the cartoons, you can't ask from a people who has not yet killed his own god to behave gently. This was an attack to their bellies, inside. Very very probably amplified by conspiracy artists... But, again, you cannot blame the people. AND, be sure THEY HAVE NOT chosen IGNORANCE... If it only was a matter of choice, *sigh*...

Beating innocent syrians is extremely basic, the people who see themselves as the "fine and more evolved citizens of lebanon* are no less primary than who they charge daily with "barbarism" [yiiiii biekhro bel ramel!!!]

Burning a consulate, even if it was the Devil's himself, is no good. At least, if they actually GOT the damn consulate, it would have been somewhat "good", but they burnt THE WHOLE BUILDING BUT the f**** consulate :)))

Do you think ppl living around deserve this thrill, on a sunday morning, on the behalf of your ideological loves and hates? nope, got friends who live there, got their cars smashed, didn't find this funny... at all...

Anyway, conspiracy here, conspiracy there, yyyep, it might be all there. IT is good to respect ppl's feelings, I would, as I live there, bil wekr, but i doubt a dude in danemark could have even thought about it... Then u got the european ego, who wants to prove some lost convictions [lost as a result of sionist harrasment? pfff whoknowz...] and push the button... added with some frustration... added ver a little bit of fear...

Do you people think you can really discuss such a subject in here?

You will need weaponz! :)) cheerz //

 
At Tuesday, February 07, 2006 2:23:00 AM, Blogger End racism said...

Ramz, perhaps it is a symbol of oppression, but that is not why it is written there and you know that as well as I do.

No I do not see only one side of the story. I see all sides. I see the oppression of the Muslim and Arab people by tyrants, and I speak out against them. But it doesn't mean that I should support what the West is doing (for example in Iraq).

 
At Tuesday, February 07, 2006 2:28:00 AM, Blogger shlon said...

PLEASE allow me to CORRECT some thing::

I totally agree with the first COMMENT // and not the POST, as I said in the beginning of my prev comment :) sosory // mymistake <<

as for the post itself // legitime, but still, c.f. "THEY DID NOT chose..." etc... :) ciao!

 
At Tuesday, February 07, 2006 2:30:00 AM, Blogger Maldoror said...

Hahahaha! Ramz I am well aware of ur agenda! :P
I moved homes two days ago! U can burn blogger now :p
P.S: It is on the 15th floor :P

 
At Tuesday, February 07, 2006 4:10:00 AM, Blogger Bo Derek said...

End racism, if you see all sides...

Why don't you change your slogan then? Because that chip on your shoulder isn't going to end anything. I can understand some of your points but you're basically dominating the discussion with an agenda that isn't relevant to the people reading this blog. Nobody here seems especially racist, and the cartoons were a swipe at religion. Islam encompasses many ethnicities, I saw a fair freckled red-head wearing the hijab yesterday. The whole insult burn slash hack mentality might be about cultural (or even class) shit-stirring but it isn't about race, if anything it's about testosterone because I have yet to see media coverage of women rioting in the streets.

 
At Tuesday, February 07, 2006 9:49:00 AM, Blogger nobilis tobilis said...

End racism
final advice
Abt the racism, start with yourself or
change your nickname

 
At Tuesday, February 07, 2006 10:51:00 AM, Blogger End racism said...

bo derek, the message remains the same. Racism, xenophobia, whatever I put. And make no mistake, there is a lot of anti-Arab sentiment that accompanies these cartoons.

 
At Tuesday, February 07, 2006 5:12:00 PM, Blogger Bo Derek said...

Well whatever, "end racism" can't be anymore damning a name then nobilis tobilis. I just listened to a blogger who actually published the cartoons, he didn't sound racist, but he did seem to have missed out on the "extra" three pictures (or preferred not to think about them) and didn't seem to understand the impact of the publishing on top of all the other antagonisms that've been going on "behind the scenes". Which I found disappointing, he was just another pawn really, in a game where different sets of people have different value systems, and have been shown and told completely different things. It's a crap game but it's not racism, it's psychological warfare.

The best way to end racism, is to end the war. But you won't end anything while you carry on preaching your anti-racist message to a page full of people who are not, as far as I can tell, racist.

 
At Tuesday, February 07, 2006 9:19:00 PM, Blogger neruda said...

End Racism i support you ...

the funny 14 march coalition of thieves, ignorants and mass murderers blames it all on syria ...how nice ...and smart ...!!!
It definitely takes the responsibility off their bloody shoulders !!

 
At Tuesday, February 07, 2006 9:38:00 PM, Blogger CMAR II said...

hmmm....the source of one of those phony cartoons finally comes to light.

 
At Tuesday, February 07, 2006 9:38:00 PM, Blogger CMAR II said...

hmmm....the source of one of those phony cartoons finally comes to light.

 
At Tuesday, February 07, 2006 11:38:00 PM, Blogger Ramz said...

nice cmar ii.... what do you think now, danny?

 
At Wednesday, February 08, 2006 12:07:00 AM, Blogger End racism said...

Hi Neruda (cool guy). Indeed. (btw, are you by any chance part of the No Frontiers group?) :-)

Ramz, what do I think of what? We already discussed the actions of the Imam. Please do not change the topic. The fact that those 12 cartoons were published (and some time ago the same newspaper refused to publish Jesus cartoons on the grounds that some readers might be offended) reveals a despicable Islamophobic agenda. Beat that.

 
At Wednesday, February 08, 2006 2:06:00 AM, Blogger Bo Derek said...

I'm not sure you geddit, end racism. There was no racism to begin with. The extra three "cartoons" are psy-op propaganda. The Imam never knew where they originated from - someone "sent them" to him anonymously and he never thought to question the source because he is a basically honest Imam not expecting to be lied too. The extra pictures are typical ministry of hate trash slipped into an info-stream that only muslims were meant to see, to make them angry, and to stir up the response we now have, to validate Bushes war. Gee whizz.

Read cmarii's link (posted on the horridly abrasive Schuster blog, but worth considering).

 
At Wednesday, February 08, 2006 11:33:00 AM, Blogger End racism said...

bo derek, I can tell you are trying real hard to cover up the real reasons the TWELVE (not THREE) cartoons were published. But it won't work on me, so better luck trying to fool someone else. I suggest that you read about the fact that the same newspaper REFUSED to print Jesus cartoons a while back. What the Imam did or did not do is IRRELEVANT. The reason Jyllands-Posten published those cartoons to begin with is racist/xenophobic/hateful (whatever else you want to call it) enough. Let's not go 'round in circles.

 
At Wednesday, February 08, 2006 2:48:00 PM, Blogger zwixo said...

come on, 4 more comments and we hit the three digit number :D

 
At Wednesday, February 08, 2006 6:46:00 PM, Blogger a h m a d said...

Zwixo, now, 3 more comments needed. :D

 
At Wednesday, February 08, 2006 8:13:00 PM, Blogger Delirious said...

Two! only two are needed now! :DD

 
At Wednesday, February 08, 2006 11:35:00 PM, Blogger Lazarus said...

yalla ... one more. has it ever reached 100 here?

 
At Wednesday, February 08, 2006 11:52:00 PM, Blogger End racism said...

It has now. :)

 
At Thursday, February 09, 2006 1:46:00 AM, Blogger Bo Derek said...

End racism, I'm well aware that the publication that published the cartoons has chosen to and not to publish certain things and have pointed out numerous times in other places that the cartoons would have been better published with an even stab at everyone else as well - if you want to go down that track why don't you start berating the Islamic bookshops that sell "The Protocols of Zion" ? But oh no, "end racism" has a bee in his bonnett and thinks he knows all about everything.

It's not about racism, it's about misinformation used to create prejudice through revenge. Racists aren't born, they are indoctrinated. for goodness sake, look at the cause, not the effect. Prevention before the cure, as they say.

 
At Thursday, February 09, 2006 11:22:00 AM, Blogger End racism said...

So it was just a fiasco

All hail the oh-so-great-and-free West!

 
At Thursday, February 09, 2006 11:24:00 AM, Blogger End racism said...

bo derek, do not even get me started on what the "Islamic bookshops" sell, because you know just as well as I do that one wrong does not make another one right. The fact that your only justification is to appeal to what the Muslims do (no matter how correct your argument is) shows your bankruptcy.

 
At Thursday, February 09, 2006 11:47:00 AM, Blogger Ramz said...

who care about all that!!!

my post hit 103 comments. Woohoo!

 
At Friday, February 10, 2006 3:01:00 AM, Blogger Bo Derek said...

Yes Ramz, and now that I've squeezed two extra comments out of "end racism" I'll be on my way. What we do for you.

 
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